Talk:Sámi peoples

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Sámi peoples article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1, 2, 3: 90 days

Arctic High‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Arctic, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Arctic on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ArcticWikipedia:WikiProject ArcticTemplate:WikiProject ArcticArctic articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Norway Low‑importance

	Norway portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Norway, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Norway on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.NorwayWikipedia:WikiProject NorwayTemplate:WikiProject NorwayNorway articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Sweden High‑importance

	Sweden portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Sweden, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Sweden-related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SwedenWikipedia:WikiProject SwedenTemplate:WikiProject SwedenSweden articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Norse history and culture High‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Norse history and culture, a WikiProject related to all activities of the North Germanic peoples, both in Scandinavia and abroad, prior to the formation of the Kalmar Union in 1397. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.Norse history and cultureWikipedia:WikiProject Norse history and cultureTemplate:WikiProject Norse history and cultureNorse history and culture articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Finland High‑importance

	Finland portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Finland, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Finland on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.FinlandWikipedia:WikiProject FinlandTemplate:WikiProject FinlandFinland articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Russia High‑importance

	Russia portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Russia, a WikiProject dedicated to coverage of Russia on Wikipedia. To participate: Feel free to edit the article attached to this page, join up at the project page, or contribute to the project discussion.RussiaWikipedia:WikiProject RussiaTemplate:WikiProject RussiaRussia articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Ethnic groups High‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Ethnic groups, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of articles relating to ethnic groups, nationalities, and other cultural identities on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Ethnic groupsWikipedia:WikiProject Ethnic groupsTemplate:WikiProject Ethnic groupsEthnic groups articles

High

This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

WikiProject Ethnic groups open tasks:

Here are some open WikiProject Ethnic groups tasks:

Meta-tasks:
- Place the {{Ethnic groups}} template on the talk page of articles within the scope of this project.
- Resolve the disparity in importance rankings among different ethnic groups
Articles about ethnic groups that currently have issues needing resolution:
Start an article:
- Wikipedia:WikiProject Ethnic groups/Article requests

Feel free to edit this list or discuss these tasks.

On 15 June 2020, it was proposed that this article be moved to Sami people. The result of the discussion was not moved, discuss individually.

On 22 October 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Sámi to Sámi peoples. The result of the discussion was moved.

Sources does not support forced sterilization

I've been trying to research forced sterilizations of the Sami and have been looking for sources supporting this claim. In the section "genetic studies" it claims that forced sterilizations of Sami is an example of discrimination against them, and cites three news articles about the Swedish forced sterilization program to support it. These articles does not mention Sami people, rather it mentions racial hygiene, which I do not believe is sufficient for a claim that ethnic minorities were targeted by the program. It might be true that the program disproportionally targeted Sami but this claim needs to be supported, especially since every direct source I have found by a government body or independent group, including investigations by the Swedish state, have found that Sami women were not disproportionally sterilized by the program. https://www.regeringen.se/contentassets/68b217b7f8e746a799536f3ad851c05e/steriliseringsfragan-i-sverige-1935---1975/ 85.224.75.191 (talk) 07:03, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I looked through the sources supposedly backing that content up and none of them mentioned the Sámi, so it appears to be a case of WP:SYNTH and I have removed it for now. If reliable sources supporting such content in regards to the Sámi can be found, it can be restored. TylerBurden (talk) 13:44, 12 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Notable people of Sámi descent: Samuel Balto (who is “Nansen”?)

Please link to Fridtjof Nansen in the comments on Samuel Balto in the “Notable people of Sámi descent” section. As a non-Scandinavian, I had no idea who that was, so context/deep linking would have been nice. --78.23.192.69 (talk) 14:08, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Added a link. TylerBurden (talk) 18:43, 9 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Head-scratching sentence

At the time I'm typing this, this article contains the sentence "While Norwegians moved north to gradually colonise the coast of modern-day Troms and Finnmark to engage in an export-driven fisheries industry prior to the 19th century, they showed little interest in the harsh and non-arable inland populated by reindeer-herding Sámi." Okay, so who were the people living along the coast before the Norwegians got there (if it wasn't the Saami, who are implied to be dwelling in the "harsh and non-arable" interior? If NOBODY was living there, justify the use of the word "colonize" instead of "settle" or just "move to". Land that isn't previously occupied can't be colonized. It can be settled. This isn't just a little "gotcha" about using the wrong word. I believe that the REASON for using the wrong word is to bias us against the Norwegian settlers.2600:1700:6759:B000:E894:BFCC:705D:880 (talk) 19:49, 8 June 2024 (UTC)Christopher Lawrence Simpson[reply]

Another head-scratching sentence

As I'm typing this, the article says "Around 1500, they" [the Sámi] "started to tame these animals" [reindeer, hitherto wild] into herding groups, becoming the well-known reindeer nomads, often portrayed by outsiders as following the traditional Sámi lifestyle." The sentence makes it sound like the nomadic reindeer-herding lifestyle DID become the traditional lifestyle of the Sámi. If outsiders thus portray it as such, why would that be noteworthy? I mean, if the traditional lifestyle of the Maasai centers around their cattle, an encylopedic sentence with no xenophobic axe to grind would be "The traditional Maasai lifestyle centers around cattle", while the hypothetical sentence "Outsiders portray the traditional Maasai lifestyle as being centered around their cattle" conveys some kind of grievance against what outsiders may say, even if it's true. This is not neutral and encyclopedic.2600:1700:6759:B000:E894:BFCC:705D:880 (talk) 20:02, 8 June 2024 (UTC)Christopher Lawrence Simpson[reply]

Later on I find the sentence "Traditionally the Sámi lived and worked in reindeer herding groups called siidat, which consist of several families and their herds". So, this sentence says that lifestyle WAS (or is) traditional, without qualifying that statement by saying "according to portrayals by outsiders". Shouldn't someone write in and protest that sentence by saying that it comes from an outsider point of view? I've often stated one Wikipedia article to be contradicting another (which is ignored with the disingenuous "Wikipedia can't be used as a source for Wikipedia" as if it's no defect for one article to state "Down isn't up" while another states "Down is up"), but today is the first time that I can remember finding one sentence contradicting another sentence IN THE SAME article.2600:1700:6759:B000:E894:BFCC:705D:880 (talk) 20:11, 8 June 2024 (UTC)Christopher Lawrence Simpson[reply]

Peoples or People?

Is the plural justified and do Sámi really identify themselves as "peoples"? Note that they have one anthem, one flag, one university, joint international political representation, etc. Anyway, to describe Sámi as "peoples" the article needs sources. Where are they?

Note also this sentence in the article

Finland recognized the Sámi as a "people" in 1995

where "people" is used in singular. --Rießler (talk) 14:09, 30 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Rießler: The title of the page was moved a year ago, see this move "discussion": Talk:Sámi_peoples/Archive_3#Requested_move_22_October_2023. I haven't noticed the discussion, otherwise I would have strongly opposed it because of its poor rationale; linguistic affiliation is distinct from ethnic identity, and in the case of the Sámi, linguistic diversity does not entail that Sámi would self-identify as distinct ethnicities along the lines of the scholarly linguistic classification of the Sámi languages. The closure after seven days with only two brief "support" !votes just endorsing the non-argument of the move rationale was obviously premature. It's too late to contest the closure, but a new move discussion that explicitly points out the flaws of the first move (both discussion and closure were flawed) should bring back a title that better conforms[1] to Wikipedia's naming conventions like WP:COMMONNAME. –Austronesier (talk) 10:22, 5 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]